Improvised armored vehicles

[ISC]

I was on the base last month and saw a local sherrif's department's armored vehicle. It seemed to be a F350 dually with welded on 1/4" plate. It had observation/firing ports and shutters for the windshield. My overall impression was that I could have done it in my backyard for about $20,000 in material in about 200 man hours.

I started thinking about what the uses for something like that would be. There aren't really many practical uses for it in anything short of a Mad Max
post breakdown situation

I got to thinking about how it stacked up compared to an up armored Humvee. I don't think that many improvised up armored humvees are still around, but I know alot of vehicles were modified in theater with varying degrees of success. I've thought for a long time that a modified civilian truck would be a better choice for 99% of the military missions that we use humvees for.

I have some ideas about what I would do to a vehicle like a F250 4WD to make it more mission capable if I had the choice of using them as a starting point for a general purpose military vehicle.

Cue "The A Team" theme music

Some things I'd definitely want:

1) diesel engine
2) 4WD
3) 4 door model
4) 1/8" steel and kevlar layered armor
5) frame mounted cab cage to provide hard points to attach armor
6) Dual fuel tanks

What other things would you want on such a vehicle and what would be the additional considerations in the vehicles design if you were building it?

What sort of missions would you think that an armored vehicle could be the most useful?

[paintballmagnet]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

Around here it too congested for one to do much except get the occupants crisped by the first can of flamable liquid someone hits it with. Perhaps running road blocks out on an open hiway might be a good use for one, anything else....?

[RT]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

You might also consider going in an entirely other direction, - get a cheap old used 4X4 SUV and strip it way down.

I was thinking something along the line of a Chevy S10 Blazer with the 4.3 V6, early 1990s vintage. Remove the doors rear hatch and rear quarter side windows. Cut a hole in the roof. Remove the passenger side rear seat and replace with a tool box that is small enough for a far rear passenger up in the cupola to get in and out through the door. You leave the main front winshield in place. The rear cargo area hatch gets replace with a cargo net.

The cupola would consist of a big hole in the roof with a swiveling conversion van type "captains chair" with the seatbelt built in. Integrate the oversize roll cage with the roof rack. Stuff on the roof rack also serves as cover for the guy up on the "cupola".

As for the improvised armored vehicle, you might be able to get one of those bank delivery armored cars on surplus pretty cheap. The Sheriff department where I used to live was getting them for next to nothing. Equip and outfit it as you see fit.

Then there are those bus style RVs, but you could armor the cab the way Clint Eastwood did in _The Gauntlet_. In theory you could do better with modern materials and a "drive by camera" system.

Maybe think about getting a milsurp Humvee?

[ironjaw83]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

i fugure runflats go without saying.
winch.
tool side boxes for weapons and tools? like this?

[dunkel]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

I seem to recall hearing something a while back about using phonebooks to harden a vehicle to some degree. Line door panels and floorboards with phonebooks, I guess. I've personally never tried it, of course, but I can confirm that even at close range, .223 will penetrate only about 2 or 3 books, maybe 4. I would imagine for frag, shrapnel, or handgun threats, a single layer of good sized phonebooks would probably work just fine. Also, as it's completely concealed, it doesn't draw a bunch of attention like a fully uparmored vehicle might attract.

[Old Man of the Mountain]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

Lots of rifle rounds can penetrate quarter inch armor.

Sand is cheaper and works better, if you can work out a way (sandbags?) to put some sand between you and the threat.

If the need arises, there will be sandbags at our home, have not considered an armored vehicle though.

[noname762]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

Two things here: This thread is 3+years dead and buried.

Improvised Armored Vehicles. Considering what's coming down the pike an Armored Technical sounds like a reasonable idea to kick around...

Earlier this week I read about a man who got even with City Hall. In the center of the town of Gramby or Grandy Colorado around 10 years ago he lived in his shop and built up a Killer Dozer. He bought a D9 sized or larger CAT type dozer and spent 4 months armoring it. He used half inch steel with concrete sandwiched inside. I would guesstimate 90% of the machine was armored including the operators cab and tracks. He installed cameras for a 360 degree view. He had gun ports on all 4 sides. One of his weapons was a Barrett 50cal. He had 3 more rifles, a few handguns and buku ammo.

Basically this guy got screwed by town politicians, the cops and a cement plant. He effectively destroyed the towns City Hall and cop shop, the town newspaper, an appliance store that took their pound of flesh off him and a major chunk of the cement plant. At least 6 vehicles were destroyed or heavily damaged.

He was stopped only when the cops managed to score some hits on the radiator and he lost his coolant. As the cops tried to get to him in the cab he took his own life.
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Seems to me you could do near the same thing with one of those huge Front Loaders or Off Road Articulated Dump Trucks. Or an armored KW/Pete/Mack with Side Dump . Cutout roof on passenger side and mount a heavy weapon. Eight or ten firing positions along each side of the . Let the imagination run hog wild idea wise.
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I've saved the best for last and quite frankly I'm surprised none of you beat me to it.

Across the USA and Europe there are many folks who participate in WWII Reenacting. These folks go hog wild with the entire look and feel of uniforms, weapons, gear and Vehicles.

In 2008 or 2010 at a WAC Gun Show some WWII Reenactor club members drove a WWII Willy's Jeep and a White Scout Car to the show. At other shows I've seen Ferret Scout Cars with and without turrets.

In an old (1998) issue of Military Vehicle Magazine they've got ads of 1943 White Half Track, 1962 UK Ferret MK2/3 street legal w/calif Title $16500, Russian BTR40, 1981 Cadillac Gage Peacekeeper Armed Recon Vehicle.

FWIW this is my 2 cents worth.

[Papadoc]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

Need an armored vehicle, take a look at this site. http://www.armyjeeps.net/index.htm

[noname762]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

Need an armored vehicle, take a look at this site. http://www.armyjeeps.net/index.htm

Well I'm glad to see it don't take much to reawaken the ARMORED Thread.

BTW that website is indeed Military Vehicle Magazine which I subscribed to for a time back in 1998. I just spent 10 minutes there drooling over a Canuck built Sherman. Holy Loony in '98 a guy had a fully restored Sherman priced at just $50 Grand.

Those days are OVER unfortunately.

All the same there's still a fair bit of WWII and since ARMOR out there. It's really just a matter of money. How much do you wanna spend??

[ISC]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

I still don't have anything like an armored vehicle, probably never will.

I see the "technicals" that are used in third world cesspools and think that something like that would be useful as our country descends into increasingly third world conditions.

I think building a mostly off road Assault Vehicle wouldn't be too hard though. You could keep it loaded with gear and equipment in a sealed and secure environment.

[noname762]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

I still don't have anything like an armored vehicle, probably never will.

I see the "technicals" that are used in third world cesspools and think that something like that would be useful as our country descends into increasingly third world conditions.

I think building a mostly off road Assault Vehicle wouldn't be too hard though. You could keep it loaded with gear and equipment in a sealed and secure environment.

A buddy of mine bought a quad for chores on his land. It's a real brute with plenty of tie down spots for spare gear.

Why not bolt a Saiga 12G with 10-12R Mag on swivel mount on handlebars? Excavate a hole and place a 20 foot container. Camouflage the 'hide'. I bet you could park 2 quads inside with a quantity of fuel/ammo and what have you.

[ISC]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

I like the side by side Polaris rangers. I think they'd make a very capable tactical vehicle under the right circumstances.

Even a quad could serve alot of uses with just minor modifications. I saw something on a program that the Isrealis are using.

It's funny how jeeps got bigger and bigger until they got too big, now light scout vehicles are filling in the void.

[Papadoc]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

Quads are like the Huey's of old, you hear them long before you see them. And unlike the Huey's they are easy as heck to ambush. Same with motorcycles. Way to noisy and no protection for the rider(s). For scouting I would prefer something quite, either a bicycle or an electric motorcycle, golf cart or something like that. To be honest, if I had the land and money to do so, a horse would be the best.

[ISC]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

I would bet that a vehicle could be quieted down alot with a custom muffler, especially if you don't mind giving up some horesepower.

OK, here's a different vehicle entirely than the one I first wrote about on this thread, years ago.

-Side by side 4WD ATV powered by a 1000 cc inline-4 Jap motorcycle engine
-Runs on 2 compressed propane BBQ grill tanks or other small tank
-High efficiency mufflers could be easily bypassed (selenoid) for extra power
-External frame/cage for packs, supplies, or even weapons strapped to it
-hard point incorporated into the frame for a heavier weapon or seat on a swivel.
-additional battery and alternator for inverter, spotlights, accessories
-sealed storage compartment
-cupholder

[Anthony]

Re: Improvised armored vehicles

Look up early armored vehicles of the Israeli army.

They used stripped down heavy trucks hardened with sandwich armor - usually plate-concrete-plate. These worked quite well for transport, evac and busting road obstacles.

Tires are the weak link.

During WW2 truckers dealt with tire shortages by using laminated hardwood tires. Noisy but worked quite well. Nailing tire tread to the wheels might cut down the noise.

here's some Concrete Cav-

http://www.warwheels.net/SandwichArmoredTruckINDEX.html