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  • Silver as an antibiotic.


    Question - is colloidal silver for internal use? Yes, I've heard the "silver spoon" stories. It doesn't make much sense to me. I'm familiar with the biocidal effects of many metals. Why silver?

    RS

  • #2
    The theory behind colloidal silver is based upon Middle Ages myth. Supposedly the rich folk did not catch plague, etc because they got a steady supply of silver in their diet because they always ate off of silver spoons. 2 things wrong with that equation:

    1. They used wood, pewter and other metals as well for what silverware they did use, almost always at that time strictly knives and spoons. Silver even then as now was for special occasions, not necessarily everyday use unless your name was Henry VIII.

    2. They did in fact catch plague and other diseases. It happens they were not infected at the same rate as the commoners simply because they had the benefits of better sanitation and isolation from those who did not.

    Other “proof” cited as to the presumed effectiveness of silver are such past practices as placing a silver coin in the water barrels of the pioneers. As the story goes they didn’t suffer disease as a result. A quick glance through the history books shows that disease in many forms was rampant, ranging from smallpox to scarlet fever.

    Silver solutions gained popularity with doctors for a time in the 1800’s and early decades of the 1900’s. As a result argyria – the accumulation of minute silver particles under the skin – was fairly widespread. Keep in mind during the same period of history strychnine, arsenic, mercury, coal tar (taken internally!) and other compounds and poisons were prescribed regularly. Medical training was not then what it is today, and anyone with a medical degree could tout their own brand of medicine, and no few did. It was the days of compounding, when the pharmacy would mix on demand whatever the doctor ordered, if the doctor did not do their own.

    To its credit topical silver preparations do seem to possess some very serious bactericidal properties. Products such as Silvadene Cream, and silver impregnated bandages both have a well accepted history of use for burn victims and other cases for the properties are needed for seriously damaged skin. I have had Silvadene used on myself and have used it numerous times over the years on other patients.

    Silver is excellent when used in certain applications at inhibiting the growth of bacteria. Virucidal properties are also claimed by some but I have been unable to find specific references to same. Specific bacteria tested in lab studies include:

    S Areus (Staph)

    P. Aeruginosa (Pseudomoas)

    C. Albicans

    E. Coli

    A. Niger

    E. Faecalis (Enterococcus)


    Controlled studies showed inhibited/eradicated growth in test mediums of these agents for the 28 days the tests were conducted.

    [Argamentum Medical, LLC ]http://www.silverlon.com/studies.html]

    Another study has shown “significantly reduced” levels of viral activity in 3 HIV+ patients with intravenous use of a silver solution. Note carefully they do not claim a cure, and in fact were careful to state that viral activity was not eliminated. There is a very significant difference there. We are also talking about patients who have a 100% lethal disease, for whom long term harm from silver is not a factor. In effect, what they achieved was a stasis of viral growth, rather than a “cidal” activity. IOW the study did not show that the virii – whatever they were, HIV or others – were killed outright.

    [Reduction in Viral Load in AIDS Patients with Intravenous Mild Silver Protein – Three Case Reports Dr. Ward Dean, M.D., Pensacola, Florida, Dr. Glen Wilcoxson, M.D., Gulf Shores, Alabama]

    Yet in another study looking at silver as an agent for water treatment noted that it had a “relatively ineffective virucidal effect.”


    [The efficacy of long-lasting residual drinking water disinfectants based on hydrogen peroxide and silver:
    R Pedahzur, D Katzenelson, N Barnea, O Lev, HI Shuval, B Fattal and S Ulitzur; Division of Environmental Sciences, the Freddy and Nadine Herrmann School of Applied Science, Hebrew University of Jerusalem, Jerusalem, Israel]

    Contrast these with the extremely often repeated claim that: “Laboratory testing has shown that silver is effective against more than 650 different infective organisms including bacteria, viruses, fungi and parasites. It has no adverse side effects and is completely non-toxic…“ As yet I have been unable to find a single reference to any laboratory test that shows more than perhaps 15 different microbial agents tested against silver in any form. Also keep in mind that in vitro testing (petri dishes, IOW, or at least outside the body) is not the same as in vivo (internal) testing . As far as in vitro testing you can literally duplicate results using common household bleach. However, internal use may very well kill the patient. There is a vast difference between something effective externally and internally.

    So in summary, no, despite claims of effectiveness silver has not been conclusively shown to be effective save for topical applications in the form of impregnated bandages and creams. In water filters it is used to inhibit bacterial growth on the filters themselves, not as an agent to be introduced into the water.

    RR


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    Real survivalists can take care of their own sick and injured. http://medtech.syrene.net/

    [This message has been edited by Reasonable Rascal (edited 29 June 2002).]
    Tricks and treachery are the practice of fools, that don't have brains enough to be honest. - Benjamin Franklin

    I have but one person on my ignore list. Can you guess who it is?

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    • #3

      Reasonal Rascal - thank you for that comprehansive reply. I appreciate your time!


      I'm involved in biomedical research and I can tell you that just because something works in the test tube or in cell lines, that may have NO applicability to in vivo studies.

      Case in point - Ebola does not rupture cells in culture, but in humans...

      In my work, I usually perform the first evaluation of a mechanism in vitro. Once it has been characterized, I take the experiment to my mice. Rarely is something as simple as in the tube...

      RS

      Comment


      • #4
        RS, quite interesting tidbit about Ebola. I finally read the book (William Close, M.D.) How many new medications have been rejected before ever reaching the FDA because in vivo studies did not follow the predicted path of in vitro studies?

        Colloidal silver - so called because it is actually a suspension rather than a true colloid, but the name stuckk way back when - is one of my personal disappointments, as when I first heard of it back in "97 I was impressed by all I read and had high hopes for it. It was only after I began digging into it that I discovered it was all either hype or since-rejected medical opinion.

        One study of 9 common (commercial) solutions marketed at health food stores found that two of the products were contaminated with micro-organisms, and only 4 of the products showed any anti-microbial activity when tested in vitro. I may only surmise that the 2 contaminated products must have contained organisms not included in the "650" it purportedly inactivates.

        FDA lab studies have found that the amount of silver in some product samples has varied from 15.2% to 124% of the amount listed on the product labels. Remember, these were commercially prepared solutions that presumably have at least some production control. Home-built units are based on theory and I dare say never actually tested for production results.

        On a side note, regarding your research, I would be interested in hearing more. Feel free to drop me a line.

        RR



        ------------------
        Real survivalists can take care of their own sick and injured. http://medtech.syrene.net/
        Tricks and treachery are the practice of fools, that don't have brains enough to be honest. - Benjamin Franklin

        I have but one person on my ignore list. Can you guess who it is?

        Comment


        • #5

          Interesting, RR - I'm a big fan of "alternative" medicines - as long as they go through the same double-blind tests that ever other drug goes through. I think that if they are going to be given as a drug, they should be evaluated as such.

          To silver's credit, as you mentioned silvadene creme seems very efficacious as I've known two burn victims who've used it during their recovery. I'll take the topical application and eschew any thoughts of internal use. Come to think of it, most metals DO bioaccumulate. Most minerals besides iron are only needed in trace amounts.

          Some of my research I'm free to talk about and some I'm really not. I study allergy, and specifically, the genes governing allergy. I have many different mice missing one or more genes that code for immunological signaling molecules. My email is stewcat1@yahoo.com is you're interested.

          Again - thanks for your time!

          RS

          Comment


          • #6
            I am also a proponant of viable alternative medicine. In fact, if one were to check my storeed meds you'd find a box of botanicals such as echinacea and others right next to a large box of OTC meds and a few stashed Rx meds that were surplus to my needs at the time.

            Silver as a medicine has its uses and I agree with and have used it in the past as such. But efficacy in one area does not automatically translate to efficacy in other areas.

            I have over the past few years used St. John's Wort, some herbal bronchial remedies and some specific vitamin supplements beyond a simple multi-vitamin, in this case for supplemental healing of some nasty wounds including compound fractures. Calcium, Vit. C, Vit E (which is fat soluble BTW folks, and accumulates if taken in too large doses over time) and Vit. D to aid absorption of the calcium . Used with understanding and purpose they represent no threat. But anything taken for medicinal purposes can be abused.

            Thank you for the question, RS. The discussion was informative for myself as well, re: Ebola. I have an amateur side interest in tropical diseases.

            RR

            ------------------
            Real survivalists can take care of their own sick and injured. http://medtech.syrene.net/
            Tricks and treachery are the practice of fools, that don't have brains enough to be honest. - Benjamin Franklin

            I have but one person on my ignore list. Can you guess who it is?

            Comment


            • #7
              Good info here guys! Thanks!

              Comment


              • #8
                I'd heard about how well colloidal silver works on burns, so I decided to try it on sunburn. Results...very impressive! My son was at a friends house and they went swimming. He came home with a pink back and bright red shoulders. I just wet his skin down with it and let it evaporate on him. Within hours the pink had turned into tan, and the red shoulders had turned pink. They healed in half the time of aloe, and with hardly any peeling. I just reapplyed it twice a day while he was healing. Good stuff.

                We made a home generator. I've cured a sinus infection with it, but it didn't do a thing when I had the flu or pneumonia.

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                We'd better get back because it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night. Mostly.

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                Man, what's the big deal...? ****ing waste of ammo. Must be a chick thing...

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                • #9
                  I have a couple of tubes of Flamazine in my kit. Stuff is "gold"(pardon the pun) for burns. It is a Silver sulphadiazine cream w/
                  a topical antibacterial agent.

                  Comment


                  • #10

                    When used it to cure your sinus infection - how did you administer it?

                    RS

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      One and a half teaspoons, three times a day. You don't just swallow it, you half to swish it around in your mouth for about 30 seconds first (like mouthwash). You can also put some drops in your nose and let it drain out through your mouth. It took about 10 days or so to totaly clear it up, but that's how long regular antibiotics take.

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                      We'd better get back because it'll be dark soon, and they mostly come at night. Mostly.

                      -----------------------
                      Man, what's the big deal...? ****ing waste of ammo. Must be a chick thing...

                      Comment

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